+84 votes
in Suggestion by (290 points)

Thank you for taking the time to read my suggestion. Lets get to it.

TLDR: There should be the requirement of more materials needed to unlock tiers after the HUB, or some kind of resource sink. It seems sooo easy to unlock everything, there almost isn't a point of automation until Tier 5-6 and even then it seems relatively easy. I want my automation to mean something! If the factory isn't for unlocking tiers, then there needs to be something to pour my factory output into.

I will clarify that I mostly mean tiers 3-4 and henceforth. As Gusaboo pointed out on the discord, needed logistics upgrades, namely the splitter and merger, don't come until Tier 1-2 so it would be annoying to set up any kind of worth-while factory before then. However after this point, tier 3-4 should require more materials than it currently does, tier 5-6 should require a very high amount (say 15k-35k) of tier 3-4 materials PLUS the new ones, and so on, increasing the amount of materials needed exponentially each time and not getting rid of the previous tier of materials. This would give purpose to huge factories, exploration to get overclock upgrades and new fuel sources, advanced logistics networks, using the ports on the side of the space elevator, etc. Everything in the game would make sense to do and feel very organic.

As it stands right now, you can progress through tier 4 without a single factory building in less time than it would take to build the factory itself. Tier 5-6 seems like it would take some automation to complete, but nothing too big. Overclocking is nice I guess, a very cool feature, but when I see an overclock bug I'm just like "cool, I guess I'll pick that up" and then throw it in a chest. Power basically isn't an issue at all because the factories just aren't big enough to require anything big. Exploration seems forced and inorganic because I don't need to get any more resources than what is already around my base. Hell I don't even use all of that.

Anyways, this is of course only my personal opinion, and although I think I made some good points I know not everyone is going to agree with me so feel free to add your input. Thanks!

by (360 points)
Later milestones could also be shifted away from being fixed quantities to production quotas like "x amount of y resources per minute for z minutes" piped into the Space Elevator. Manual crafters would have to stagger delivery, and factory builders would have clear numbers to get excited about.
by (490 points)
That would be nice, but as an option before starting the game.
If someone prefers exploring the game would become very hard for them when they come back and need say 1000 reinforced plates for tear 3.
by (2.3k points)
Too easy to game though, just pre-load items into a container and then dump them into the elevator.
by (1.5k points)
What if advancing to the next tier required a sustained number of parts/min to the space elevator? Not for just for a limited amount of time but this requirement was added to with each tier. If you stopped the supply, you would loose access to some tech. This would encourage you to build multiple factories all over the map, instead of just staying in the same spot. Then you could use containers as buffers for power outages and re-organization but it would be impractical to cheat the system with manual crafting the goals. The craft bench would still be good for building those new factories though.

12 Answers

+13 votes
by (1.5k points)
I also think they should be tweaked a bit. There is almost no benefit to automation when you can use the craft bench faster for anything. The most tedious task is getting leaves/wood for energy before you have coal.

It is also possible, that the values have been tweaked in this beta so most players can experience all the tiers. I hope so.
by (290 points)
^this. I hope the values for the tiers were lowered only for the alpha test. But I had no problem with the biofuel once I had the chainsaw tbh
by (3.2k points)
I don’t find getting leaves/wood very tedious, the player can just press E.
But I agree to make the craft bench slower.
by (1.7k points)
Yeah I hope so too I was thinking it should take 1000's not 100's of mats in the tier 4+
+9 votes
by (14.1k points)
I'd point this suggestion towards a difficulty level option at game start that puts an exponential multiplier onto ingredient requirements.

currently there is a hike in "raw" material cost for each tier - but I understand your desire for greater challenge  / slower pace.

there have been many upvotes on slowing the crafting rate in the manual bench for instance - which would have a direct impact on your experiance above.

Keep in mind though that the first hour (or 3) of play NEED to be kept relatively uncomplicated and achievable for EVERYONE - so that they can hook as many new fish as possible without scaring them off with "you now have to sit here holding LMB for 30 minutes so you can have enough stone to make a crude knife."   (lots of exageration but you get the idea)
by (290 points)
edited by
LOL yeah nobody wants to do that. I just want automation to serve a purpose is all. I don't care how they do it, whether that's through the crafting bench or through my suggestion. The only issue with the crafting bench nerf is that it still wouldn't take that big of a factory to get the resources to unlock up to tier 4.
by (110 points)
I would be happy with the crafting bench being slower - though I would much prefer if it slowed down over time - like as it got hot (which I assume is what the heat effect is about). Say it starts like it is now, and every 5 seconds of straight crafting it slows down a small fraction, until you let the bench cool down a bit.

However, as a sufferer of carpal tunnel, I strongly suggest a "start" button that you can click, and then watch the bench go, rather than being forced to hold the LMB down.

It's fine that you have to stand there watching it, and if it went slower that increases the value of the factory a lot. But honestly I made a factory mainly so I didn't have to sit there holding the button down, which is bad for your wrist.
by (640 points)
I hear you on the wrist thing. I prop my stapler up on the mouse button if I need to hold it longer than a few seconds.
by (1.7k points)
Yeah I was thinking they could simply use a "cool off timer" for hand crafting and when crafting something that is in higher tier maybe have it allow like 5 and then can't hand craft more for a minute or two (not this small of numbers but you get what I'm saying)  more like craft 50 and be unable for like 5min something like that and on the lower level stuff iron/copper to ingots make that number much higher like in the 400 range before a cooldown is needed.  this would make early game fast but making a manufacturer shouldn't be able to be hand crafted faster than making the machines do it.
+5 votes
by (370 points)
I think they wanted it low so that people could see the whole game in alpha over a weekend, but not sure.

It would not be fair to do a weekend alpha and then make tier 1 so difficult to reach it takes you the whole weekend.

Well I hope so anyway, I would also like to see an actual reason to automate, there needs to be  a proper resource sink
by (290 points)
I hope this is the case as well.
by (120 points)
I thinks the same, but it will be good to have confirmation by the devs
by (100 points)
Alpha tester here - There is no difference between the Closed Alpha Version and the Test weekend version (except for the addition of t4/5 in closed)
by (1.8k points)
I think it as well. I believe they will rebalance everything when we test all the tiers and the improvements. I don´t know about the closed alpha, but  there is a difference between alpha weekend and the early access, the balance of some process and materials to get t here.
+2 votes
by (7.5k points)
Wow such long answer. I agree with no need for exploring, I Just walk more than 300m in order to build a conveyor to a miner. I mostly enjoy preparing lines for automation, I love the preplanning part where I have to write down required materials and then choose the rite variety of machines and belts to get Best reslults.
by (290 points)
Haha yeah I just want to see this game succeed :) I enjoy it as well, I just want to give all that automation a purpose ya now?
by (7.5k points)
Yeah, however I only quite dont like the MK stuff, but its kinda okay, you unlock better belts, better miners etc and you can rebuild your lines 1 by 1 what is an natural process we also See in Real life :)
by (14.1k points)
you missed out on a lot if you didn't go exploring - a lot of us were able to bring back stuff to research alternate (cheaper / faster) recipes for instance
+2 votes
by (3.2k points)
I think automation is important from tier 1. Even if it’s just a mk 1 miner and smelter job, it’s really useful to steadily produce iron while the player goes to get copper or limestone with the portable miner.

It really helped me out, it allowed me to multitask.
by (290 points)
Yeah it is nice to have it crafting while you're away, but I don't think there is an emphasis on it. Past the early game, I'm literally never away from my base unless I need to expand, which isn't necessary at all in the current state of things.
+2 votes
by (150 points)
Agree with all points. I only  have access to the first 3 tiers but it feels like there needs to be a resource sink of some kind. 99% of the time my factory is filling a storage container. I feel like it would have been way more efficient to just hand craft all the stuff for the SE milestone. Maybe that's what ADA had in mind when she told us to be efficient.
by (290 points)
*Holds LMB* -> Maximum efficiency achieved.
+2 votes
by (940 points)
I must say, I had no automation.  For the ores I made only the drills and placed them.

Was so easy to run to the drill, back to the banch and press he spacekey. Then only a click at the hub behind me for the next upgrade.

The ore was was very easy to find because we started with a scanner (with  big Range!)
by (290 points)
Yeah, this is why the game has to be changed. It's ridiculous that it's a factory game, and the factory seems totally useless.
+1 vote
by (1.4k points)

I posted up this suggestion as a way to have both a resource sink as well as a time-based threat:


I do agree the tier progression could use some balancing, and the elevator is so-little used, maybe only unlock one tier at a time just to pace things out a bit.

+1 vote
by (700 points)
I disagree kind of. I feel that the tiers we have so far are meant to be the early stages of the game and that subsequent tiers of production should get require less than exponentially more resources to attain in order to prevent the game becoming too much of a grind to progress in.
0 votes
by (290 points)

I completely agree that there needs to be some sort of resource sink in the game. The space elevator seems to be a logical choice because it has inputs and signifies the objective which is delivering materials to the "company". Right now we build factories to fill limited capacity storage and then our machines sit idle until we grab some material for building, then it hurries to fill the few open slots before stopping again to wait.

We need goals that are defined by  "x amount of y resources per minute for z minutes" (to quote opherthegold ), or atleast a "trash" container so our resources get dumped when storage is over capacity and we can still see our factories producing things.

P.S. I personally decided I would only use the crafting bench sparingly, like biofuel if I'm out exploring. But I played with a factory first mentality, I would rather spend my time making the machines that will make the parts, then standing infront of a craft bench holding down the space bar. Even if manually crafting is a little faster.

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